【留學馬拉松-留学梦的意识形态-05】 “我们不是外星人”:中国学生融入美国大学 续

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发表于:2015-05-08 11:00 [只看楼主] [划词开启]

还记得之前的中国学生我们不是外星人”呐喊的帖子吗?这是后续


Darren • 2 days ago
This is a real problem, and I feel for the Chinese students.
I recommend some of the other videos, because [E03], the one provided here, may turn you off. In particular, I thought it was ill-considered to make fun of America's monolingual culture in support of an otherwise valid point: Chinese students find it more natural to speak Mandarin among other Chinese.
BUT, I also think the [E03] video reveals a fundamental truth. Just as Chinese are primed to enter US universities to get good grades rather than earn English fluency, so too are they primed to enter US universities to earn a degree and return to China to pursue career success (or attain a more favorable hukou) rather than get an authentic American experience.
Those Chinese who really desire to get the authentic American experience should be encouraged, and in this regard, as an American, you will be able to pick up on the difference. All of the Chinese in these videos are working really hard to meet American college students half-way. That will not be true of all American-based Chinese in college.
Also, who cannot feel for the Chinese freshman who finds the American College party scene either confusing or inane. The Chinese would be pretty much right. Its not obvious that the American habit of self-destruction becomes a means to connect with others.
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这可是个现实问题,而我和中国留学生们感同身受。这篇文章里贴出的第三集视频,会改变你的看法,所以我推荐大家去看这系列的其他视频。尤其重要的是,我觉得该视频讽刺了美国的单一语言文化:中国留学生比其他中国人更爱说普通话。但是我觉得第三集也揭示了一个现实问题。那些准备来美国求学的中国留学生更倾向于获得漂亮的成绩单,而不是流利的英语,因此我觉得那些准备来美国读大学的中国留学生并不是为了拥有真正的在美经历,只是为了得到一纸文凭,帮助他们回国后找到好工作(或者得到他们想要的户口)。
那些想获得真正在美经历的中国人应该受到鼓励。出于尊重,作为一个美国人,我们大可以放下成见。这个视频里的中国人正努力和美国大学生妥协着。不可能所有的中国学生都有在美国生活过的背景。
还有一点,中国新生肯定会为美国的疯狂派对感到迷惑不解。中国人太正确了,美国人习惯性的自杀行为(指疯狂的派对)并不代表着他想和别人交流沟通。

Kingandrew Darren • 2 days ago
There's a sizable number of American students who find the college booze scene confusing and pointless, too.
Maybe they and the international students could connect and create their own social scene.
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很多美国大学生也觉得那些酒精派对很无聊,而且一点意义也没有啊,
或许他们和国外留学生可以做朋友并且举办属于他们自己的社交活动。

Ashley Flinn Kingandrew • 11 hours ago
At the University of Kansas, my friend (who was head of the Japanese Student Association) and I frequently hosted dinner/movie parties for the international students. It provided them a very different American experience. They'd get to meet Americans who weren't into the party scene, but weren't just interested in Japan for the Anime/Otaku stuff. We'd cook American food or traditional Japanese dishes that they couldn't get here in the states. It was a lot of work, but also a lot of fun.
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在堪萨斯州立大学,我的朋友(日本学生协会会长)和我经常为外国留学生们举办电影以及晚宴派对。这为他们提供了很特别的在美经历。他们可以在活动里和不欢喜派对的美国学生交流,而这些美国学生也不是只喜欢看日本动漫的宅男。我们为他们准备了美国菜肴和在本地吃不到的日本传统料理。这需要很多准备工作,但是充满了乐趣。

erictan Darren • a day ago
I'm pretty sure that Chinese who go to study at universities in the USA, the UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand are the same, in that they don't really integrate by speaking the local language and making lots of friends who come from diverse backgrounds. I'd say that their basic knowledge of the English language is nothing but a requirement for entering whatever university will accept them, and after that's taken care of (TOEFL and other exams), they will choose to concentrate on their major or specialized discipline, which will not very likely be English Literature... Many universities require that English courses be taken and research papers be written once or twice during their two or four years of study, and that requirement is probably the one thing they dread, so they cheat or get others to write said paper(s) for them.
I didn't care much for the partying when I attended university in the USA (in the early 90s), couldn't afford it anyway, but my fluency in English made it easier for me to be more socially active and to have friends from many nationalities, backgrounds and walks of life, and I did my best to enjoy this diversity unlike other Chinese students I knew... But it's also unreasonable to expect such people to do these things. They're basically paying quite a lot of money for their education, and not for socializing and so on.
By the way, one thing I never was able to get into was American-style football, and there were those Chinese students who wanted to partake of all things American, like Spring Break, the Fourth of July, Thanksgiving and the Super Bowl, things they found "interesting", and I never understood their seemingly "forced" integration. I guess these arrived never intending to leave.
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我很确定那些去美国,英国,加拿大,澳大利亚以及新西兰的中国留学生都是一样的。他们都不想说本地的语言。而且交不到来自不同国家的朋友。我想说的是,他们的英语成绩(托福,或者其他测试)只是用于申请大学。在通过这些测试以后,他们通常只关心自身所选的专业知识,而留学生们通常不会选择英国文学专业。。。。在大多数美国大学里,在2到4年的学习过程中会设置英语课程,并且要求学生完成一到两篇的调查报告。这对外国留学生来说很可能是一场噩梦,所以他们会选择作弊或者枪手来完成论文。
90年代早期,当我在读大学的时候,我并不是很留意那些派对,反正我也负担不起。(译注:一般美国的大学派对,男生需要付入场费,而女生不用,入场后酒水任喝)但是我流利的英语让我在社交活动里游刃自如,而且交到了很多不同背景的外国朋友。我很享受这种多元化的感觉,不像我认识的那些中国同学(封闭自己),但我也没有理由让所有人像我一样。中国留学生更愿意付大价钱去学习,而不是用在社交和别的方面。
顺便说一句,我很不喜欢美式足球,而这却是中国学生们最想参与的运动。就像春假,美国国庆,感恩节和超级碗一样,(译注:超级碗,类似于我国的春晚),这是他们的“兴趣”所在,我理解不了他们这种“被迫的”同化。我估计这种情况将不会改变。

tomfiore • 2 days ago
A relative of mine had a roommate from China her first year at college. My niece isn't a part of the drinking or hookup culture and she herself places a high value on studying and academic achievement. She is also a very friendly person and very approachable.
Her roommate came to the US to study with an expressed intention to learn to communicate in English as one of her goals. Unfortunately instead of trying to communicate the roommate had very few conversations with my niece and spent the time either with her head in a book or with other students from China. This was for a full year.
It isn't odd for roommates to have nothing in common, what is odd is that they don't develop some sort of bond over the school year. I don't know if this is the typical experience, but what seemed to me happened was that the roommate only felt comfortable in her alien group and stayed there.
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我的亲戚在读大一时有个中国室友。我这个侄女并不喜欢喝酒,而且喜欢研究和学习。她也非常友好和平易近人。
她的中国室友来美国读大学的其中一个目标就是学会用英语做日常交流。令人遗憾的是,在这一整年,这个中国女生只和我的侄女做了简单的交流,而其他的时间都用在了书本和中国同学身上。
奇怪的不是她和室友们没有共同语言,而是怪在为什么一整年她都不去发展和室友们的关系。我不知道是否每个中国留学生都这样,但是这个事实告诉我,中国室友只有和她的外星人团体呆在一起时才觉得舒服。

Paxmelanoleuca tomfiore • 2 days ago
My post-graduate cohort at a major university in the Southeastern United States was 13 Chinese scholars and me. I encountered similar dynamics. They would take all the same classes and spend all of their time interacting with each other (even speaking in nothing but Chinese while in the classroom and waiting for class to start). Outside of the classroom, it was similar, with many preferring to spend time eating only at a few local Chinese restaurants or at home and socializing only through the multiple Chinese student oriented groups on campus.
While on the one hand I can certainly commiserate with the difficulties of "finding a fit" in a host culture (I spent several years working and living in East Asia after undergrad), its odd how frequently the blame for the cultural separation is squared at the host culture, and not the visitors. Multiple students complained about stereotyping of Chinese students by Americans, but would avoid American students based on Chinese stereotypes of Americans. The end result was that many rarely, if ever, bothered to reach out to the non-Chinese community. Inclusion is a two-way street, and although there are certainly things that host universities can do to enable visiting Chinese scholars to make non-Chinese connections, it's inaccurate to pretend the failure is purely the fault of host institutions or American rejection of Chinese attempts to integrate.
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我是一名正在准备毕业的研究生,就读于美国东南部的某所重点大学。我的班上一共有14人,其中13名是中国人。我也遇到了相似的情况。我的中国同学都选一样的课,而且把其余的时间都用在他们彼此身上。(甚至不用互相招呼一下,他们就会在教室里坐在一起等待上课)。课后也是一样的情况,他们更愿意花费时间回家自己做饭吃,或者是去本地几家中餐厅吃饭。他们只在中国学生占多数的组织里才有社交活动。
一方面,我当然同情他们适应美国主流文化的种种艰难(我在本科毕业后在东亚工作和生活过几年),奇怪的是人们总是局限的谴责当地主流文化造成了文化上的差异,而那些移居者却没有责任。许多学生抱怨美国人对中国留学生持有刻板印象,但是却避谈中国人对美国学生的刻板印象。这造成了极少极少的中国人愿意接触非中国人社群。包容的环境需要双方的努力,虽然美国的大学有责任去采取措施,让中国留学生们可以接触非中国人,但这么做就错误的把所有失败都推到了学校身上,而且美国人也不应该阻止中国人聚在一起。

Flatley Paxmelanoleuca • 11 hours ago
I go to Madison, the school profiled in the article, and I can verify that many of these students will clique together in a way that guarantees a sort of desired alienation. An interesting dynamic at play is that many of the students have families who are either politically well-connected or otherwise wealthy, and it shows in an affected air of superiority. Couple this with the general notion that American students are inferior to all others, and you have a recipe for non-interaction between the two cultures.
On the other hand, exceptions do exist. I had the privilege of getting to know a recently-graduated Chinese PhD student in my research group very well, and he is someone who I hope to maintain connections with for a very long time. He was even nice enough to introduce me to the Chinese tea tradition, and gave me a tin of tea leaves from his home province when he left.
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我去过麦迪逊,就是文中的那所大学。我可以确定那里有很多学生都将加入他们渴望进入的异类小圈子。那所学校里有一个有趣的情况,很多学生的家庭都有政治背景或者很有钱,校园里弥漫着带有优越感的做作氛围。结合这点来看,我认为美国本地学生根本不能和别人相比,这就是为什么两种文化没有交集的原因了。
另一方面,也有例外存在。我有幸结识到一位最近毕业的中国留美博士生,他在我的研究团队里非常出色,我希望可以和他保持长久的联系。他人非常好,甚至向我介绍了中国的茶道,在他离开的时候还送给我一罐从家乡带来的茶叶。

erictan Paxmelanoleuca • a day ago
Agree completely. I went to the USA for university back in the early 90s and had a great time. I knew about life in the USA before going, and I chose to go there, so being there, there was no reason not to interact with locals and other students from other countries as well. Otherwise, why go there at all?
There are foreign universities (mostly Australian) here in Hong Kong that offer degree courses for locals, in Chinese, so they are able to obtain university degrees from accredited foreign (Australian) universities without ever learning a foreign language (English). I find it odd, but it works. It is a business, after all.
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完全同意。我去过美国读大学,在九十年代初时回国了,那真是一段美好的回忆。在我留学之前我就了解了美国的生活方式,然后我就选择去美国,所以在美国的时候,没有任何理由不去结交本地人和其他国家的朋友。否则你去美国是为了什么?
在香港设有几所外国大学(大部分是澳大利亚的),可以为当地人提供大学学位课程,而且是中文授课。因此当地人甚至不用学习英语就可以得到认证过的外国大学文凭。我觉得这很奇怪,不过他确实存在。反正这就是一门生意而已。

CzChick23 tomfiore • 2 days ago
I had a Chinese roommate while I was studying in the UK. Her father sent her to the UK when she was 16 and ordered her to graduate from Cambridge. Her English was pretty poor, she was taking English and chemistry classes mostly during those 6 months. She was driven and studied a lot but didn't mind socializing either - movie nights with pop-corn, some art exhibitions...
And no, she would not make the first step...I had to suggest and invite but she was very happy to accept. Many women from this culture are extremely shy and also embarrassed by their strong accent. Sometimes we just need to reach out.
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我在英国留学的时候有一个中国室友。她父亲在她16岁时把她送到了英国,然后命令她要考取剑桥大学。她的英语实在是太差了,她在那六个月里主要学习英语和化学课。她学习挺努力刻苦的,但是并不重视社交活动,比如和大家一起看看电影,一起去参观艺术展览等等。。
因此,她并没有踏出第一步,我后来建议和邀请她参加活动,想不到她竟然很高兴的答应了。其实很多在中国文化熏陶下的女生都非常的害羞和矜持,有时我们需要做的仅仅是伸出双手。

RandolphOfRoanoke • 2 days ago
I came to America for college without any previous exposure to an English-speaking country. Admittedly, coming from Europe is much less of a cultural adjustment than coming from China, and there's also less of a temptation of sticking with your own because European countries have fewer students at American schools and typically don't form distinct social groups there.
That being said, the problem with students from large Asian countries, in particular India and China, integrating into campus life seems to have as much to do with them as it does with the Americans. Two anecdotes:
- I was randomly assigned to a quad room for my first year with three Indian students. It was separate rooms with a connected living room, so everyone would have a good level of privacy no matter what. The three Indian students regularly explained to me that theirs was an Indian-only room, and they went to the housing office repeatedly to find another room for me, eventually with success. One of them apologized privately, and I think sincerely, to me when his buddies weren't there, but behaved the same when they were.
- An American friend of mine learned Cantonese and had lived for some years in China. He wanted to join a Chinese student club for language practice and cultural immersion. At the first meeting, he was asked "Are you white?" in a tone that he interpreted as a clear signal of not being desired there. I don't even want to image what would happen if a typically white student club, say a frat or maybe a golf or sailing club, did the same with a non-white student wanting to join.
Obviously, these patterns by no means hold for all students from these countries. Many hang out with peers from outside their home culture, join students clubs, and some even pledge Greek organizations. But a substantial share of Chinese and Indian students plainly seems to have no desire for any contact with American students, doesn't get any spoken language practice outside of the classroom, and seems not to want any cultural enrichment from the experience other than the diploma and possibly a path to a Green Card.
As for the unusual dropout rate, I hate to say it, but the well-known prevalence of fraud with credentials in the countries in question might also have something to do with it. Some students from these countries arrive with such abysmal language proficiency that it's hard to believe that they properly earned their TOEFL and SAT scores.
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我在去美国留学前从来没有接触过英语国家。当然了,来自欧洲的学生比中国学生更能适应美国文化,而且欧洲的学生没有多少诱惑去坚持自己的文化,因为在美的欧洲留学生很少,根本不会形成小圈子集团。
我想说的是,那些来自亚洲大国的留学生,特别是印度和中国的学生,要比美国本地学生融入校园生活付出更多的努力。下面有两则小故事:
在我大一的时候,被分配到一间四人宿舍,三个室友都是印度人。那间宿舍是四房一厅的,所以能保证大家都有良好的隐私空间。这三个印度人不停向我解释这间宿舍只能住印度人,他们还数次跑到宿舍管理处帮我找另外的房间,最后他们成功了。其中一个印度人私下里向我道歉了,我觉得挺真诚的,但是在他的同乡面前,他又换了一副嘴脸,坚持他们的决定。
我的一个美国朋友曾经学过广东话并且在中国住过几年。他想加入中国留学生协会来练习中国和接受文化熏陶。第一次去参加活动的时候,他被问到“你是个白人吗?”他说那种语气透着一种明显的信号,就是不希望他在那里出现。我甚至不愿意去想像这种事情发生在一个白人学生组成的协会的情形,想想看如果一个兄弟会,一个高尔夫协会或者是一个帆船协会,向一个非白人问同样问题时的情境吧。
显然的,并不是来自这些国家的学生都这样。很多留学生和同龄人一起去接触不同的文化,加入不同的学生社团,有些留学生甚至效忠于希腊组织(译注:美国大学兄弟会的一种,多数为白人会员,有种族倾向)。但大部分印度和中国学生似乎没有和美国本地学生接触的欲望,他们从来不在课后和别人做些口语练习,他们好像只对文凭和绿卡感兴趣,而不是获得宝贵的文化交流经验。
至于那不同寻常的辍学率,我很讨厌谈到这点。但是我们应该采取措施去解决某些国家众所周知并普遍存在的成绩欺诈问题。来自这些国家的某些学生英语水平非常糟糕,很难相信他们的托福和sat成绩是通过自己得到的。

NonnerDoIt RandolphOfRoanoke • 2 days ago
I generally agree with your perspective, but I think your unpleasant experience with the Indians might be a little unusual. At least your experience was not mine. The Indians I knew did stick together somewhat, but individuals were open to communication and once you befriended one the group would warm up. In return I was sometimes used, willingly, as leverage into the American world. Language facility is probably a big part of it. India is pretty saturated with English - at least among the upper classes. Not so China.
Furthermore, my wife is at a major high tech company. A large percentage of the employees are Chinese. The majority of the Chinese hang around with the other Chinese only. They'll get along ok with their co-workers and may share lunch with them on the road, but there is almost zero socializing outside work with non-Chinese. There are lots of Indians too. While they do hang around each other quite a bit, the friendly non-Indian can sometimes get an invite to a Diwali celebration. More to the point, one of the best ways to get a job at this big company is for somebody already inside to refer you. It is well known that Chinese NEVER refer non-Chinese. Indians will mostly refere Indians too, but its not so uncommon for them to refer non-Indians.
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回楼上,我基本上同意你的观点,但是我认为你和印度人之间发生的不愉快事件可能是很少见的。至少我没有过你那样的经历。我认识的印度人确实比较喜欢聚在一起,但是对他们个人来说却很开朗友好,只要你结识了他们中的其中一个人,那么他们整个团体都会对你热情起来。作为回报,我有时去做而且愿意成为美国世界的杠杆。语言水平是其中重要的一项,英语在印度非常流行。至少是在印度的上层阶级里非常通用。而中国不是那样。
此外,我的太太是一家高科技公司的管理人员。这家公司的大部分员工都是中国人。大部分中国人只和中国人一起活动。他们都和别的同事相处的不错,也会在工作的路上和别人分享午餐,但是他们基本上不会和非中国人有任何的业余社交活动。公司里也有很多印度人,他们经常会和别人一起参加活动,非印度人朋友也会被邀请参加印度灯节的庆祝仪式。更重要的一点是,在这间大公司获得工作的最好途径是公司内部有人推荐你。众所周知中国人从不推荐非中国人入职。大部分印度人也只推荐印度人入职,但是他们也没少推荐非印度人。

erictan NonnerDoIt • a day ago
See? That's why San Francisco, Los Angeles, and New York had (and still have) Chinatowns in the mid-nineteenth century. As racist as having these communities appears to be, it's logical that they exist. Same thing with universities and Chinese students. Can't blame them for doing that, and can't blame others for disliking or criticizing them for doing it. Unfortunately, it does breed suspicion and contempt. Hm, how many are spying for China, and so on.
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看到了吧,这就是为什么旧金山,洛杉矶和纽约从19世纪中就开始有唐人街了。由于种族主义的原因才会有这种社区存在。同样的,美国大学和中国学生之间也存在这种情况。不能谴责他们这么做,也不能谴责别人不喜欢或者批评他们这么做。不幸的是,这会导致怀疑和轻蔑。嗯嗯,多少人是中国的间谍啊,诸如此类的这种说法会冒出来。

RobertSF RandolphOfRoanoke • a day ago
It's only bigotry and xenophobia when we do it. When people from the Third World do it, it's "their culture" and we must accommodate it.
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当我们这么做的时候就是偏见和仇外。而第三世界的人这么做的时候就是“他们的文化”,并且我们必须包容他们。

matthewhubbard • a day ago
I work at several colleges in the San Francisco Bay Area and I see the problem from a different perspective. A lot of Chinese have a hard time understanding English and their problems are not with slang but with the structural differences between the languages, like plurals and verb tenses.
As someone who has tried to learn other languages (I can speak a pidgin version of Spanish, French and Italian, with Spanish being my strongest), I don't want to judge them. But I would NEVER go to a country where my language skills were sub-par and try to be a student at the college level. Even if China were the absolute pinnacle of my field (mathematics), I would not go there to learn, even if my Chinese skills were my best current second language. I know I'd be missing too much.
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我在旧金山湾区的几所大学工作,我从不同的角度看这些问题。很多中国人很难去掌握英语,他们的问题不是听不懂俚语,而是不能理解两国语言的结构差异,比如英语中的复数和动词时态。
当一个人尝试去学习另一种语言时,(我可以混杂多种语言来说话,如西班牙语,法语以及意大利语,我的西班牙语最好)我不想批评他们。但是我绝不会去一个自己掌握不了该国语言的国家读大学。尽管中国在我的专业领域中处于绝对巅峰的位置。(我的专业是数学),我也不会去中国求学,尽管中文是我目前掌握的最好的第二语言。因为我明白自己水平还差得远呢。

MikeJake • 2 days ago
Just my personal perspective here, but at least with regards to east Asian students, I didn't experience any of the supposed diversity benefits from having them attend my university. They seemed to keep to small groups of compatriots, they didn't seem to socialize much outside of these small groups, and their grasp of English didn't seem strong. They may as well have been assigned to separate classrooms, as nonexistent as their participation was. All of this contributed to the pervasive suspicion that they were helping each other cheat on assignments.
Again, just my anecdote.

这只是我的个人观点,但至少大家关注到了东亚留学生,我没有和他们一起参加过多姿多彩的大学活动的经历。他们看起来都在自己的小圈子里活动,他们好像不愿与圈子外的人交流沟通,而且他们的英语水平似乎也不太好。他们被学校刻意的分配到不同的教室上课,但他们并不能融入其中,就像不存在一样。这些行为引起了别人的普遍怀疑,他们之间帮助彼此,靠作弊完成功课。
再次重申,这只是我的故事。

erictan MikeJake • a day ago
Nope. Not your fault. You're not a bigot. Chinese students are like that. I'm Chinese; I know this. And I wasn't your typical Chinese student (thank God). I would have met you and spoken to you.
I'm gonna use the R word, so don't freak out. Yes, it's a kind of racism too. Chinese, good and trustworthy; Caucasians, African-Americans and fratboys, no way.
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不,你错了,你不是一个偏执狂。中国留学生就是那样的。我是一个中国人,我懂他们。还有我不是你眼中的典型中国人。(感谢老天)。我会和你一起出去,而且会和你聊天。
我想对你用“弱智”这个词,请你不要崩溃。是的,这也是一种种族歧视。中国人,友好而且可靠,比白人,黑人还有兄弟会的人靠谱多了。

theAmericanist • a day ago
A few observations:
1) Pretty much all groups of foreigners will speak their native language to each other whenever they can in a foreign country. If anybody thinks this is a unique characteristic for Chinese students on American campuses, they need to hang out in more restaurant kitchens. Comprende?
2) To be precise, Chinese students ARE -- literally -- an "alien group", in the sense the word alien is used in the law: they are foreigners here, just as Americans are foreigners THERE. One significant conceit that Americans need to get over -- it is genuinely xenophobic -- is the idea that everybody in the world is really an American in values and principles, except Americans who recognize that's not true.
3) It is NOT true that Chinese students in the United States are an enormously diverse group. They are overwhelmingly Han, almost exclusively the privileged children of privileged parents (the grandchildren of party cadre who were lucky enough to prosper in the Deng transition to capitalist Communism) who did not get here by rocking the boat, and they are ALL the culled pick of the smartest, most academically competitive youth from a nation of 1.4 billion people. If you think that's a diverse group, you must be utterly astonished that NBA players are taller than most of us.
4) Speaking 普通话 is not the most important disconnection that typically exists between Chinese students in the US and Americans. Nor is it cheating.
What is arguably far more important, is that Mao largely succeeded in his half-century long purge, intended to create a new political culture in China which is entirely distinct from the civic ideal that Americans sometimes imagine is universal.
Generally speaking, an American has been brought up to recognize individual and collective contributions to the common good.
America has a characteristic dynamic between economics and civics -- somebody invents a better mousetrap, and they 'share' it by getting rich selling it. But if somebody has a better idea for governance, we would be appalled if it ONLY benefited that guy and his allies -- no matter how hard a small group had to work to make it happen, we'd think it was wrong to exclude people. That's not a contemporary Chinese political cultural trait.
I once explained Jonas Salk giving away polio vaccine to a group of Chinese students: they ALL thought he was a sucker.
see more
10 1 •Reply•Share ›

一些观察结果:
1)绝大多数外国团体的成员间都用母语交流。如果有人认为这是在美中国留学生的特征的话,他需要多去餐厅的后厨逛逛,明白吗?
2)确切的说,中国留学生从字面上来看就是“异类集团”,在这层意义上,异类这个词出现在法律条文中:他们在这里是外国人,就像美国去了他们那儿以后也是外国人。美国人需要抛弃一个显著的狂妄想法,这是真正的仇外行为和想法,认为世界上的每一个人都应该和美国人拥有同样的价值观和原则,除了那些意识到这是不可能的美国人。
3)在美中国留学生并不是一个多种族人群。他们绝大多数是汉族人。父母和他们自己几乎都是特权阶级。(他们都是有幸赶上了邓小平资本共产主义政策的红三代)他们并没有在美国惹是生非,而且是从14亿人中精挑细选出的最聪明,最具竞争力的孩子。如果你觉得他们是一个多样化的人群。那你一定也会惊讶为什么NBA球员比大多数人高了。
4)中国学生讲普通话并不是和美国人疏远的原因。也不是因为作弊。
最重要的原因是,毛在中国成功的进行了长达半个世纪的大清洗,旨在中国创建一种全新的政治文化,这和美国宣扬的普世价值和公民意识有很大的不同。
一般来说,一个美国人从小就被教育道,个人和集体的生产建设是为了我们的共同利益。
美国政治和经济之间的联系有一个显著的特点,比如,某些人发明了一个好用的鼠标,然后他们通过销售致富来“分享”这一成果。但如果某些人对政策有了好的建议,我们就会为他们施行政策的利己行为而震惊。尽管这个团队为此付出了巨大努力,我们都觉得排斥别人是不对的。而当今的中国政府没有这种特点。
我曾经解释过为什么乔纳斯送脊髓灰质炎疫苗给中国学生团队时,会被中国学生骂混蛋。(后面还有很长,不翻译了,这人来写中西文化比较论文吧,我了个去。)

t_lhrh • a day ago
I studied in a Chinese university for a semester last year. Good to know that the Chinese I learned did not just fly the rusty old coop that is my brain. I was able to understand around 70% of the Chinese writing in the subtitles in their videos! (The fact that these phrases translated English speech helped, obviously.)
That being said, I noticed something curious in China that is reflected in these videos--how Chinese women are the ones much more willing to strike out and make friends with foreigners than Chinese men. Though I had a very shaky grasp of Mandarin (especially spoken Mandarin, which I still find incredibly difficult to speak or follow) I went well out of my way to pierce the foreign-friend bubble when I was in China--because, really, I didn't fly halfway around the world to end up talking all the time to a bunch of Americans, Canadians and Europeans. Curiously, the only people willing to take me up on my offer of friendship (and informal Chinese language lessons) were Chinese female students at the host university I was attending. Only one Chinese male student did this, and he did so half-heartedly.
Also, when I was doing my master's in an English-speaking country, there was this Chinese woman living in our little dorm hallway with a shared kitchen. One day, when we bumped into each other in the kitchen, I learned that she was having a hard time befriending people, so I invited her out to meet my friends. She very enthusiastically took up my offer. Later on she floated into a Chinese circle of friends (it was obvious that she still felt befuddled by Western customs and modes of socializing, with her broken English making her feel very self-conscious), but at least she was game to pierce her bubble. No Chinese man was ever that open to meeting new people, at least at the university where I completed my master's.
From these interactions and anecdotes, I concluded that Chinese men are far less likely to stick their necks out and get to know you as a foreigner, whereas Chinese women were for the most part enthused by the idea of making international friendships (with foreign men and women alike). Maybe Chinese men are socialized to like subject matter which leads to little or no interaction with foreigners whereas Chinese women go into subject matter--like foreign languages and literature--that necessitates flexible thinking and an international component. So I find it bemusing, and not at all surprising, that the foreign students who came up with these videos trying to analyze and partly fix the acculturation problems were Chinese women.
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我去年在中国的大学里学习了一个学期。很高兴我没丢掉学过的中文。我能看懂视频里70%的中文字幕!(显然通过翻译这些中文帮助了他们的英语演说)
话虽如此,我注意到了视频里反应出了我在中国遇到的怪事,就是中国女生更愿意和外国人交往和做朋友,而不是中国男人。虽然我的普通话只有半桶水,(特别是口语,我到现在都觉得听说普通话极其困难。)我在中国的学习非常顺利,因为我没有结交所谓的外国朋友。因为,我真的不想在飞过了半个地球之后,和一群美国人,加拿大或者欧洲人对话。奇怪的是,那些肯帮助我学习还和我交朋友的人,竟然是中国大学里的中国女生们,(她们还为我补习中文)。只有一位中国男生也帮助了我,而且还是敷衍了事的。
另外,当我在英语国家读硕士的时候,有一位中国女生和我们共用宿舍厨房。有一天,我们在厨房里碰撞了一下,这让我得知她很难交到朋友,于是我邀请她去见我的朋友们。他很热情的接受了我的邀请。后来她还是飘进了一个中国朋友圈子里。(很显然,她对西方模式的社交活动感到迷惑,还有她那蹩脚的英语也让自己很不自在。)但至少她冲破了这层隔膜。从来没有一个中国男生敞开心扉结识新朋友,至少在我读研的这所大学里是这样。
在这些交往的故事里,我推论出中国男人作为一个外国人,是不可能费尽力气主动的去了解你的,而中国女人则对结交外国朋友怀有热情。(不管外国人是男是女)。或许中国男人喜欢的话题和外国人不一样,而中国女人则和外国人有共同话题。比如外语和文学,这些话题需要灵活的头脑和国际概念。而我的沉思大于惊喜,上传这些视频并试图分析和解决文化适应问题的都是中国女性。

blackylawless • 2 days ago
At places like Cal Tech, USC, UC Berkeley, MIT, UC Irvine, & UC San Diego, they (Chinese Students) definitely are not an alien group. It's everyone else that seems out of place.
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在有些学校,例如加州理工大学,南加州大学,加州大学伯克利分校,麻省理工。。。(译注:全是美国顶级名校),中国留学生绝对不是异类,那儿只有他们存在。

RandolphOfRoanoke Bluestocking • 2 days ago
Well, the Chinese students are seeking out American campus culture. If I were to apply to a school in China, I'd fully expect that I'd have to learn both the language and the culture to make the most of my experience there.
If someone comes here as a foreign student, I'd very much recommend football games, frat parties, and such. That doesn't mean you have to paint your face in school colors or get drunk beyond reason if that's not your cup of tea, but having seen what it's like does a lot more for understanding future American business partners than just taking an engineering course in America than one could just as well have taken in another country.
Are all elements of our campus culture totally healthy and constructive? Certainly not. Is it worthwhile to learn about them first-hand when one comes here as foreign student? Absolutely.
21 1 •Reply•Share ›

好吧,中国留学生正在谋求美国的校园文化。如果我申请到一家中国的学校,我一定会努力的学习所有的语言和文化,在那获得尽可能多的经历。
如果这个帖子里有留学生看的话,我会强烈向你推荐美式足球,兄弟会派对等活动。那并不是要你在脸上涂上油漆或者是喝的酩酊大醉,如果你不喜欢的话。但是你起码可以更加了解到未来生意场上的美国伙伴们,这比在美国上一节工程课有用多了。毕竟工程课在别的国家也有设置。
我们的校园文化都是健康的和建设性的吗?当然不是。那它还值得外国留学生亲身参与吗?这是绝对值得的。

SDtriton RandolphOfRoanoke • 2 days ago
"If someone comes here as a foreign student, I'd very much recommend football games, frat parties, and such."
Has it occur to you that this is something you enjoy, and that most people wouldn't enjoy them as much as you do?
I thought one of the benefits of being in an American campus is "each to their own". I don't share your interests and I don't find things that interest me in your culture, hence I move on.
I don't have to conform to your expectation of a perfect exchange student.
5 1 •Reply•Share ›

回楼上,“我会强烈向你推荐美式足球,兄弟会派对等活动”
这是你很享受的活动,但是别人可能并不喜欢啊?
我认为美国大学的其中一个优点是“每人都不相同”。我不去分享你的乐趣,而且我在你的文化中也找不到乐趣,所以我在前进。
我没必要成为你所期待的那种完美交换生。

rithipol KoeniginLuisevonPreussen • 2 days ago
Whoa, someone has a beef with the Chinese! China is an immensely large country, and Chinese students in the States come from diverse regional backgrounds and varying socioeconomic situations…and they come to study in the US for a multitude of different reasons. Perhaps before alleging that an entire country is doing one behavior, you may want to consider the fact that you're making sweeping generalizations about a very complex situation. Evidence of your xenophobia is quite obvious here.
…And I've also been a graduate student instructor at the University of Michigan for the last 6 years, and of course a college student in years prior, and I have to say that I've witnessed a very active culture of cheating, plagiarism, and general academic dishonesty among college students in the US! It's just not brought to the attention of the American public. So could you please stop blaming ethnic minorities for behaviors that significant parts of the US population already does itself?
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哇,有人开始向中国人发牢骚了。中国是一个巨大的国家,中国的留学生都有不同的地域背景和社会经济情况,而且他们来美学习有着各种各样的原因。或许在你断言整个国家的人都在做同一行为之前,(指作弊,这条帖子是回应上面一个留言的,那条留言说中国人都作弊,并贴了几条链接。),你应该思考一下,事实上,你正在笼统的概括一个非常复杂的情况。从你罗列的证据可以看出,你也太排外了。
我在密歇根大学做了六年的毕业讲师,我在几年前也是一个大学生,然而我不得不说,我亲眼目睹了美国大学活跃的作弊文化,还有抄袭和普遍性的学术欺诈!这一切只是没有引起美国公众的关注。所以请你停止攻击少数族裔吧,因为美国的主体民族就在干这些事!

dagSeoul KoeniginLuisevonPreussen • 2 hours ago
LOL. White supremacist Trolls.
•Reply•Share ›

大笑,白人主义狂魔。

Tigg SDtriton • 2 days ago
Do you think these students suddenly stop cheating when they reach US universities?
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你觉得这些学生在来到美国大学后,会突然停止作弊行为吗?

SDtriton Tigg • 2 days ago
Do you think American students will stop cheating if there were no Chinese students?
8 1 •Reply•Share ›

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